Declined [VSH] Changing the HHH Jr boss (1 Viewer)

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Scudi37

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Hi,

This time i have been thinking about doing something about HHH Jr, the weakest hale who everyone just straight up hate. Only viable in small close maps, and with most players like big open maps, playing him is a pain.

Problem with HHH Jr:
-Lack of high jump really is nerfing his mobility.
-Difficult for lower skill players, getting in air with "hit the wall" is tricky.
-While climbing, susceptible to be stomp.
-Teleport isnt helping much, better players often never use it becouse the traps set by RED, and stunt right after teleport not always work.

My ideas to fix him are:

I: Buff his speed walk stat to get him more mobile on foot.

If we dont want him to fly, maybe just give him significant more speed than anyone else. For example about 2x current speed.
Getting him more speed will also help with getting him in air with "hit the wall".


II: Just give him high jump with nerf to his stats.

The biggest issue with HHH is no jump ability, we can give him jump ability like every one else but in price of other things like removing or nerfing his stats/abilities.

I was thinking about leaving "hit the wall" and teleport and nerfing his stats speed, range etc.


III. Give him demoman shield charge ability.

I was thinking about adding him a shield charge without crits, just movement buff. More like Chargin' Targe in straight line not tide turner turning midair.
Propably this would be OP but maybe with nerfing his stats will be OK., i dont know myself.


IV. Replace him with some other boss from FF2.

Maybe someone from FF2 boss will be better than him, but i leave it to others players who would be good replacement, write in the comment.


V. Leave at current state.



I personally will vote for III.
Vote will be around for 20 days, so tell other players who dont visit forum about this CORE change to this gamemode.
 
I honestly think either increasing his speed or replacing him with some other boss would be the best options, I'll think about it before voting.

Good replacements would be Ninja Spy, Painis Cupcake or Demopan imo if we were to replace him.
 
Remove him instead
 
I didn't add remove option from start, because i don't think removing him would be good idea, there are reasons that we have other bosses besides only saxton hale.

Different hales were made with specific playstyle in mind to mix things up, and HHH is weakest from all of them, but still unique (no jump but climb). Very good players can still win with him, but not as consistent like with other hales.

Winning with him is mostly based on map that he play on:
-on non popular small maps, bad designed with no possibility to jump or getting midair, cramped hallways, he can win.
-on popular maps, more open, that's rely mostly on being more mobile, he is pain to play and many player complain about him.

I think he is hated because he isn't mobile enough, not as flexible as other hales. Maybe with buffing his mobility he will be better for most majority of players.

I'm more on adjusting things, but if community really wants it, i'am ok with adding "remove him" option.

@Madact could you please, add "remove him" option to the poll?
 
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Removing/Replacing is definitely not an option since Kevin wants to keep the VSH as default as it can be, so the bosses are definitely staying but some changes are definitely needed.
 
I voted for S1.

S2 is.. I Mean he won't be HHH anymore.

S3 Sounds not bad, but definitely can't help him much.

S4, Totally agree on replacement, but This is VSH not FF2, is it really ok to just replace HHH?
also removing him is definitely not the solution.

i get the point that he is weak failure hale but removing and stay with 4 bosses?..

replace is better than remove.


But both replace and remove Ridiculous ideas, This is VSH the default mode, So what we really need is stats changes or sort of any slight buff for his tele ability.


for example Once he teleports get uber for two seconds.

That makes him survive demoman stickies, DEFINITELY Survives Telefrag engie players.
 
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I have no problem with buffing his mobility either by a speed increase or shield charge. (2x his current speed seems broken to me so it would have to be lower)
But if these changes are not desirable, maybe further increasing his knockback resistance and giving him damage reduction will give him a better chance at winning rounds.
 
With UberMedic leaving I am unsure about the future of this suggestion. It most possibly will have to be declined due to these circumstances.

Plus part reason: If Kevin wants to keep things vanilla for VSH he might not be interested in changing the bosses at all.
 
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