Declined [JB] Remove the gas passer from RED team (1 Viewer)

[Mehgend]

Yeah that new change buffed the gas passer a fair bit.

The Neon Annihilator now gets guranteed critical hits on any player under the gas passer effect.


Initially I thought you know, most classes can just outrun the thing and itll eventually sort itself out, but its come to my intention that literally any blu side mini game that is not a teleport spot is decently close to being outright impossible to survive in.
Even without an uber you're likely to die due to taking a mammoth amount of damage just from the initial melee hit. Let alone the after burn!

It is a shame because I always found the gas passer to be funny in the past. Not feeling it so much anymore :/
Its literally the only non-gun weapon that is handed out by default, and being that it now has gotten a pretty strong buff I think it may be time to make it consistent with the rest. Open to hearing what you all have to say though.
I mean the mad milk and jarate are both completely unobtainable to REDs afterall.

 

[Xergon]

if the warden gets doused in gas and ends up getting crit'd by a red, the fault lies more with the guards and warden being unaware than with the weapon itself

also it's funny to do sneak attacks against guards and pick them off one by one

 

[Mehgend]

if the warden gets doused in gas and ends up getting crit'd by a red, the fault lies more with the guards and warden being unaware than with the weapon itself

Not really..

Just tonight I have seen several rounds with 3-4 pyros, some ubercharged, rushing guards and ending the round extremely quickly.
Its literally the exact same as a sniper running jarate + bushwaka but even more powerful when considering afterburn and the gas passer lingers.

We dont run the jarate so why should we run the gas passer when it does what that does but even more

 

[Xergon]

list of things you can do to counter a gaspasser pyro

airblast
counter-uber
slowing them down with balls
height advantage
double-quadruple jump
blasting them in the air with a rocket
forcing reds to crouch walk
forcing reds to have melee only
having more situational awareness
intentionally taking damage and setting yourself on fire (idk if this works)
long ranged melee weapons (works if there's no uber push)
forcing medics to pop ubers on themselves

 

[Xergon]

oh i also forgot to mention you can run away (although a soldier can whip a pyro so idk the effectiveness)

 

[Mehgend]

airblast

Works outdoors, but some smaller indoor areas you will run through your ammo quite quickly

counter-uber

Everything can be prevented with uber and isn't always reliable considering there wont always be a medic and there won't alwasy be an uber

slowing them down with balls
height advantage
double-quadruple jump

Forgot to say that scout is rather uneffected by gas passer as he can just outrun most forms of rebellers that dont have guns lol these, while obviously not perfect, do work just fine lol

blasting them in the air with a rocket

A lot of the times this risks freehitting/freekilling depending on the map and specific part of the map you may be at/in

forcing reds to crouch walk
forcing reds to have melee only

??? theyre rebelling regardless why would they follow restrictions like that

having more situational awareness

rebelling can be executed in ways that throw anyone's awareness in the shredder

intentionally taking damage and setting yourself on fire (idk if this works)

No.

long ranged melee weapons (works if there's no uber push)

Fair enough, but does get crippled with uber Win some lose some on that

forcing medics to pop ubers on themselves

Doesnt counter this completely, but does negate uber puhses if done correctly which is something

oh i also forgot to mention you can run away (although a soldier can whip a pyro so idk the effectiveness)

I am a bit iffy with this tbh. As a scout, spy, and medic this works, but the rest id imagine would be a little inconsistent. I'd have to see though

 

[Mehgend]

Sorry if my original reply pre-edit was a little not thought out well and weird lol I didn't read it over and wasn't in the best spirits writing it but its all good lol

 

[PistolPoppinSince02]

Just run a singular medic.

Same vein as "Ban projectiles, because warden can't counter them".

Medic is always the answer. Did you know, Gas Passer's effect expires twice as fast when being healed by a medic?

 

[Mehgend]

Medic is always the answer. Did you know, Gas Passer's effect expires twice as fast when being healed by a medic?

I actually didn’t know this that’s cool

Just run a singular medic.

Same vein as "Ban projectiles, because warden can't counter them".

I don’t think I agree with this way of seeing jailbreak



In general I feel this made me realize I didn’t quite articulate why I feel this shouldn’t be a thing and I kind of don’t like what I wrote initially lol

A lot of counters do exist for gas passer + neon annihlator (+ Uber), but I personally don’t think something that is as strong as gas passer + neon annihaltor really belongs in jailbreak the way I see JB being played

It’s mostly a social game, with skill based parts to it scattered around.
As in, you never NEED to run a specific weapon set or class lineup, different results come from the same lineups everywhere.
I feel personally that giving the red team a pretty strong push is something that kind of interferes with this.

But alas, I am in the minority on this it seems. It’s only one weapon anyway. If you all feel it should stay then let’s see how it goes lol.
And that’s fine lol. It’ll lead to funny things admittedly, but it’ll also lead to things that I said in this thread earlier. Worst case scenario is we keep it and come back to this layer if it doesn’t work out.

Or 25 people wake up and agree with me… that would be fun.

Ty for the points everyone. I may not agree with all of them, but it did lessen how strongly I feel about the new gas passer. This was a little reactionary (Apple doesn’t fall far from the tree Nergal )(Though I still feel the gas passer should be given a lil time out)


now no one better go on to suggest adding jarate I don’t like having urine thrown at me from anyone, let alone a prisoner.

 

[Nergal Nergalton]

I feel personally the best way to approach this is simply to make sure to say at the start of the round "Pyros no using Gas Passer".

 

[Monke With Internet Acces]

Can we like, not remove any new meta instantly and give players some nuance? Even if what you're saying would be true (which i don't agree upon) nothing ever happens on this gamemode. Give Blues some time and they will learn to counter it, and if they don't we can debate if it's just plain skill issue or OP meta.

 

[SirKrookodile]

With the point regarding the jarate and bushwacka. Like I get how that compares to the gas passer and neon annihilator. But jarate makes blus take minicrits regardless of who hit them. It's far more oppressive than the gas passer that only ignites upon hit with anything that isn't the gas passer. Ultimately. It's gonna be a case of watching and seeing how blus deal with it.
1. You can airblast the gas away from you (although this does risk mass baiting by proxy)
2. Restrict Projectiles completely and just kill any pyro that throws the gas before they can rush you.
3. Restrict healing early to prevent an Uber rush.
There are definitely ways to work around the gas passer and I see no reason to keep it restricted.

 

[Bananawastaken]

Declining due to poll results