JB Redux (1 Viewer)

[Semicolon Backslash]

Hello, currently we are preparing to update the old tf2jail plugin to redux on all jb servers. This plugin adds in a bunch of new features, some of which I am not sure if the playerbase wants. So in order to make sure things go smoothly I will be polling some of these.

Automatic Warday

In jb redux warday works different to how we've been doing it. Instead of blues camping an area and red's going to get ammo from armory, the plugin teleports all players to pre-determined spots on the map and gives everyone ammo and restores class specific functions (engie can build all of their buildings, spy can cloak). I would like to know if people would prefer the new style of warday or if we continue doing it as we have been.

Warden Markers/Lasers

Right now in panda you are restricted to moving reds around with simple orders such as "follow me" or "go to where I shoot" markers (and lasers) are a feature introduced that would in some ways simplify transporting reds around. The only reason I bring this up is that I believe this feature has been suggested twice before and struck down both times. I would like to make sure people would be on board with this change.

Change round timer on LR Given

Right now in Panda the round timer is static and there are no ways to increase/decrease it. With Redux you can set it so that when LR is given the round timer is set to a specific time, this could be changed to something just above 2 minutes so people wouldn't have to worry about how long a dr lasts, it could also save those rounds where lr is given in the last 5 seconds. This feature could be abused to grief rounds by elongating them or shortening them.

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[vinny]

"engie can build" as in he can build sentries? this could be kind of overpowered/boring imo unless it was restricted to minis or lvl 1's maybe lvl 2 even.
spies cloaking sounds cool but can just be abused for hiding, if no admins were to be on then people would be forced to wait minutes or even ghost to play the game at all.

 

[scootyman]

why do I not want warden markers when I can't actually think of a reason not to have them

 

[Husky]

The problem with teleporting on warday is the fact that the owner would have to add cords every time a map is added, which I can see as getting annoying, especially if mappers don't add cords to places themselves.
As for the markers, imo they just make the gameplay really boring from the other servers I played on, I don't know why, I just really don't like them. It could be due to the fact that it gives the warden a massive amount of protection since he can be miles away from the marker when its placed.

 

[Semicolon Backslash]

"engie can build" as in he can build sentries?

yes sentries included, I will also note that they will also be able to build (and cloak) on vsh and classwars lr days.

The problem with teleporting on warday is the fact that the owner would have to add cords every time a map is added, which I can see as getting annoying, especially if mappers don't add cords to places themselves.

I've already gotten coordinates for all the maps as it is still required for some other lr's.

 

[Valen]

i dont want markers just to spite bad wardens

also i hate change

 

[vinny]

why do I not want warden markers when I can't actually think of a reason not to have them

warden markers and lasers promote a pretty lazy warden playstyle, using your voice for commands is already simple enough to do, these would just clutter the warden menu for really no gain, practically useless.

 

[Zee]

warden markers and lasers promote a pretty lazy warden playstyle, using your voice for commands is already simple enough to do, these would just clutter the warden menu for really no gain, practically useless.

Totally agree, Markers just dull the traditional gameplay loop of jb and i feel like it dumbs down blue team even more since they dont have to think extensively about positioning anymore and they're just gonna hyper-focus on the markers to get kills on the reds, voice commands are simple, nice and give more clearance for blues to be vigilant on their surroundings for sneaky reds, and like what you said its warden menu clutter thats unnecessary for the gamemode

 

[megolotl]

From what I've learned from other servers making sudden updates with brand new features after being known for a certain way of gamemode, it's some of the hardest and roughest transitions for a lot of players. That's not to say there aren't some proper dev people in the panda team, there's just a lot that can break and a lot that can drive the current playerbase to ditch. I think a lot of what the current JB plugin already offers is plenty enough for the community used to it. That's just my two cents, tho

 

[Racer911-1]

Automatic Warday

the plugin teleports all players to pre-determined spots on the map

The problem with teleporting on warday is the fact that the owner would have to add cords every time a map is added, which I can see as getting annoying, especially if mappers don't add cords to places themselves.

As nice as teleporting blus to a designated area sounds like, I'm not so sure if Kevin would be willing to do that for every map we have.
It also brings up another problem, which is that, as far as I understand, limits the areas blus can go to before the reds arrive with ammo and such. Being teleported to a pre-determined spot probably also means cells are opened instantly, which gives blus relatively little preparation time.

restores class specific functions (engie can build all of their buildings, spy can cloak).

Sentries benefits mainly the blus and with good cooperation it becomes a tough nut to crack. Although reds can also use Sentries, it would mean a delay of 5 minutes before they can effectively be put to use.
Spies being able to cloak.... all I can ask is why? It's obviously just a given example but would also be good to discuss what exactly should be restored and whatnot.
It's near impossible for red spies to get in a blu occupied area without dying, while blu spies are not allowed to leave their area to kill others. And even after the 5 minutes, being able to cloak hardly gives an advantage in combat and would more likely be used to delay the round for an unnecessary amount of time

Change round timer on LR Given

Is it customizable? Or fixed?
As an example:
picking rapid rockets day as an will reduce round time to 3 minutes
picking market garden day will reduce round time to 5 minutes.
picking custom lr will extend round time to 12 minutes.
Because depending on the lr's you want for some to be more time available while for others it should be rather short. I'd rather just have it unchanged if this is not the case

 

[Zee]

Is there a way to disable the Cloak and Dagger entirely? I think that would probably minimize the damage

 

[Semicolon Backslash]

As nice as teleporting blus to a designated area sounds like, I'm not so sure if Kevin would be willing to do that for every map we have.

There is one set location for every map not multiple. The coords are used for multiple other lrs including the vsh lr and they take 2 seconds to get (also I will probably be the one to get the coords anyways).

It also brings up another problem, which is that, as far as I understand, limits the areas blus can go to before the reds arrive with ammo and such. Being teleported to a pre-determined spot probably also means cells are opened instantly, which gives blus relatively little preparation time.

This warday is more focused on red and blues fighting eachother rather than reds assaulting a blue fortress, with this automated warday blues are less likely to be organized and will probably wander the map as there is no way to specify "all guards must camp diner". Reds are teleported to another section of the map so the cells are really meaningless. I'd reccomend you play a round of warday on another jb server to see how this works.

Spies being able to cloak.... all I can ask is why? It's obviously just a given example but would also be good to discuss what exactly should be restored and whatnot.

Because without cloak they are literally relegated to trickstab and gunspy in 1v1 fights that the automated warday encourages both of which are hard for spies to do well in.

while blu spies are not allowed to leave their area to kill others.

Automated warday would kill the current camping style we have since there is no designated "spot" for blues to camp spies can roam freely.

Is it customizable? Or fixed?
As an example:
picking rapid rockets day as an will reduce round time to 3 minutes
picking market garden day will reduce round time to 5 minutes.
picking custom lr will extend round time to 12 minutes.
Because depending on the lr's you want for some to be more time available while for others it should be rather short. I'd rather just have it unchanged if this is not the case

I think you completely misunderstood me, the lr's will not change the round timer but the act of giving lr to a prisoner will shorten the current round timer to 2 minutes.

If you still do not understand I can post example videos of all of these features as I am not sure if I am explaining them properly to you.

Is there a way to disable the Cloak and Dagger entirely? I think that would probably minimize the damage

ye

 

[Racer911-1]

Nah no need I was just severely misunderstanding everything mentioned beforehand.

 

[Nergal Nergalton]

- The warday proposition sounds like an awesome idea to me personally, but can I add to that suggestion? The Jailbreak server I used to be admin for (War3Evo) had a Warday plugin which does exactly what you mentioned (all BLUs and REDs are spawned in a specific area of the map, all with ammo), but also uses spawnable props such as walls and other obstacles to block off certain areas, creating an "arena" so to speak that BLUs and REDs fight in. One of the benefits I see in this over the original Warday is that it will be harder for people on either team to hide given the smaller area given and prevent the round from dragging.
- Do you mean the type that will automatically spawn when it is clicked? The aforementioned Jailbreak server had a plugin with a menu that contained a list of all the different minigames of a map, and clicking one would activate a laser that would lead to the minigame, if that's what you're talking about.
- YES, this gets my full approval all the way. This would desperately help a lot, as it would stop rounds from dragging due to rebellers or long DRs (I say long DRs because a lot of BLUs I've seen don't know that DRs can only last for 2 minutes max).

 

[Semicolon Backslash]

- The warday proposition sounds like an awesome idea to me personally, but can I add to that suggestion? The Jailbreak server I used to be admin for (War3Evo) had a Warday plugin which does exactly what you mentioned (all BLUs and REDs are spawned in a specific area of the map, all with ammo), but also uses spawnable props such as walls and other obstacles to block off certain areas, creating an "arena" so to speak that BLUs and REDs fight in. One of the benefits I see in this over the original Warday is that it will be harder for people on either team to hide given the smaller area given and prevent the round from dragging.

Sadly redux does not have these features, it is a basic deathmatch, there are no selectable locations either, just one pair of coordinates for each map.

- Do you mean the type that will automatically spawn when it is clicked? The aforementioned Jailbreak server had a plugin with a menu that contained a list of all the different minigames of a map, and clicking one would activate a laser that would lead to the minigame, if that's what you're talking about.

Not quite, moreso a laser that the warden can use to point to things.

 

[ItsNotCalassic]

If we were to have automatic warday, wouldnt warday locations become restricted to whatever the map has set?

 

[Semicolon Backslash]

If we were to have automatic warday, wouldnt warday locations become restricted to whatever the map has set?

Yes, although blues would be free to roam around the map