Declined [JB] Definitively ban Nine Crush (2 Viewers)

[_Black]

Killorders always have 100% deathrate and no chance of surviving.

 

[_Black]

Ofcourse afk in boxgame and 9crush should always be played with atleast 9 people, because if there is just 8 in 9 crush it has the potential to be a killorder, so thats something I guess lol

Here the recent mentions of 9 crush (they all ask for it or say they love it)

 

[Nergal Nergalton]

AFK in Boxgame, Bumblebeam, and AWP Dodge ought to be kill orders too I agree.
If the solution is to ban them all, then yes we should.
My point being is that these fundamentally are Kill Orders. Nine Crush is the one chosen today because of how often I've played it in the past week alone.

Making REDs AFK in any of those minigames is not a kill order. An actual kill order is one that would absolutely 100% guarantee any and all participating REDs will die, to give some examples:
- The warden makes everyone AFK at the start of Steady Pace (the advancing motivator will kill everyone).
- The warden makes everyone AFK in Danger Below.
- The warden forces REDs to jump into the giant lava pit in Volcano.
- The warden disallows jumping and/or crouching in Speedrun, Obby, Climb, most Deathruns, or any other minigame where jumping and/or crouching is required to survive and/or advance.

Telling REDs to AFK freeze in something like Fall Game, AWP Dodge, or Box Game is not a kill order because each individual RED has a chance, no matter how small, that they could survive the minigame to however long the warden decides to make it last. The same can be said for many other map-specific minigames such as Temple Tumble on Mlcastle and Hit and Run on District.

When you really get down to it, Nine Crush is basically just Nine Square if 8 of the squares all went down at once instead of one-by-one. Each individual RED has a 1 in 9 chance of surviving Nine Crush, which is the same odds for Nine Square if you played it all the way to the last square.

I will agree with _Black and say however that the best way to do Nine Crush is to have at least one RED on every square so at least one RED is guaranteed to survive.

 

[Zee]

this recent trend of suggestions being made after people die to a minigame in the server is alarmingly common, This is really not a kill order.

Is saying AFK Freeze on any part of the map in District or Miami a kill order nowadays cuz of the trucks/cars? Cuz with your logic it is

 

[KyePerson]

2a: Prisoner rules/rights
"This also counts for Minigames, if the Warden wants you to play a minigame that requires you to break a(an?) order given before by him then you have the right to do disobey that order until that minigame ends."

If the warden told you to afk on a square before the minigame started, you should have the right to move when it starts.
As for afk orders later on in an active minigame, box game, awp dodge, deathcrate, fall game, and nine square can accommodate a late afk order. Where as you can't give an afk order late into the game of crush game, because the game actively groups all the reds into 1 spot, which would just lead to a fail round. At least afk bumblebeam shouldn't failround.

That's at least my argument for why I think afk orders in those other games are fine within the current rules but afk in crush game isn't.

 

[Cowboy]

Okay this is getting hilarious

 

[Mehgend]

I still do not understand how 9crush would be a kill order but 9square isn’t considering they are the same thing except one is a single round

This is dumb

 

[scootyman]

You are literally just wrong. It’s in no way a kill order. It’s just 9 square but faster. Is 9 square a kill order? A kill order means a guaranteed death. If ANYONE survives, it’s not a kill order. It gets the SAME RESULT as 9 square, but with less round delay.

 

[Ian]

Damn, no more telling people to afk in fall game. It’s joever (since it’s a kill order)

 

[_Black]

Damn, no more telling people to afk in fall game. It’s joever (since it’s a kill order)

No more killing rebellers (its a kill order)

 

[Mehgend]

"This also counts for Minigames, if the Warden wants you to play a minigame that requires you to break a(an?) order given before by him then you have the right to do disobey that order until that minigame ends."

If the warden told you to afk on a square before the minigame started, you should have the right to move when it starts.
As for afk orders later on in an active minigame, box game, awp dodge, deathcrate, fall game, and nine square can accommodate a late afk order. Where as you can't give an afk order late into the game of crush game, because the game actively groups all the reds into 1 spot, which would just lead to a fail round. At least afk bumblebeam shouldn't failround.

That's at least my argument for why I think afk orders in those other games are fine within the current rules but afk in crush game isn't.

1. The rule you listed doesn’t matter here because you don’t HAVE to move during 9crush. One square survives 9crush every single time the game is played. It’s literally just 9 square but it’s all done at once. You can totally be AFK frozen during 9 square

Same goes for Fall Game or 4 Corners or whatever has a similar “stand in the right spot or die” games. You can do these games while afk frozen the entire time.

2. No one is arguing being allowed to say afk freeze during crush game being played already. That would just be silly.

Edited because I hit reply by mistake while proof reading

 

[PistolPoppinSince02]

Can you elaborate on how they are kill orders?

"Prisoners have to follow the newest order even if that breaks the order given before by the Warden.
This also counts for Minigames, if the Warden wants you to play a minigame that requires you to break a order given before by him then you have the right to do disobey that order until that minigame ends."

If you want to argue that telling Reds to AFK Freeze in Fall Game is Preventing Delay, I can absolutely agree.
The reason 9 Crush is an issue, is because it fundamentally changes Crush Game.

If we want to liberally stretch the rules, I am personally okay with that, but this is verbatim our rules.

 

[PistolPoppinSince02]

Those that argue "Just Rebel" are neglecting that one game is immediately changed for another.

Yes, let me rebel after I am already in Crush Game, expecting Crush Game.
When a warden tells me to go into Nine Square, Fall Game, Four Corners, or so on, I know exactly what the minigame is and what will be played.
Therein I could then chose to rebel if I wanted to.

 

[PistolPoppinSince02]

Ofcourse afk in boxgame and 9crush should always be played with atleast 9 people, because if there is just 8 in 9 crush it has the potential to be a killorder, so thats something I guess lol
View attachment 31053

Here the recent mentions of 9 crush (they all ask for it or say they love it)

This is how often Nine Crush has been mentioned in Text Chat only.
This disregards Voice Chat.
Granted, we cannot tally up how much times it has been played or mentioned via Voice Chat.
Anecdotes are all we have in terms of that, and I would guess I've played it around a dozen or so times in the past week.
Ultimately it's a tool for lazy wardens to abuse, much like turning on CC without announcing it (in dangerous situations).

 

[Racer911-1]

If you want to argue that telling Reds to AFK Freeze in Fall Game is Preventing Delay, I can absolutely agree.
The reason 9 Crush is an issue, is because it fundamentally changes Crush Game.

If we want to liberally stretch the rules, I am personally okay with that, but this is verbatim our rules.

And this is supposed to be a bad thing? Since when did we ban minigames that don't follow the exact formula? Adding a variation to a minigame can enhance the gameplay.

Those that argue "Just Rebel" are neglecting that one game is immediately changed for another.

Yes, let me rebel after I am already in Crush Game, expecting Crush Game.
When a warden tells me to go into Nine Square, Fall Game, Four Corners, or so on, I know exactly what the minigame is and what will be played.
Therein I could then chose to rebel if I wanted to.

You're supposed to rebel when given the chance, not as a way to express dissatisfaction, let alone when you entered a minigame by your own choice. It will only bring up stale gameplay if that's all that ever happened. Which is why the wardens tend to add some restrictions to these minigames to up the stakes. 9crush is in no way different, just more uncommonly played. You can't always expect things to go your way.

Ultimately it's a tool for lazy wardens to abuse, much like turning on CC without announcing it (in dangerous situations

Unannounced CC isn't allowed anymore.
And lazy? That's like every minigame ever: "Go to X, Don't do X or you're kos". Atleast with 9crush you have to pay full attention to who does and doesn't follow these rules. It's even less lazy than normal crush game: you can leave the minigame running until the last phase and most certainly there will be only 1 red left without any additional restrictions

Anecdotes are all we have in terms of that, and I would guess I've played it around a dozen or so times in the past week.

A dozen or so is a perfectly healthy amount out of the hundreds of minigames that get played throughout a week

 

[PistolPoppinSince02]

And this is supposed to be a bad thing? Since when did we ban minigames that don't follow the exact formula? Adding a variation to a minigame can enhance the gameplay.


You're supposed to rebel when given the chance, not as a way to express dissatisfaction, let alone when you entered a minigame by your own choice. It will only bring up stale gameplay if that's all that ever happened. Which is why the wardens tend to add some restrictions to these minigames to up the stakes. 9crush is in no way different, just more uncommonly played. You can't always expect things to go your way.

Unannounced CC isn't allowed anymore.
And lazy? That's like every minigame ever: "Go to X, Don't do X or you're kos". Atleast with 9crush you have to pay full attention to who does and doesn't follow these rules. It's even less lazy than normal crush game: you can leave the minigame running until the last phase and most certainly there will be only 1 red left without any additional restrictions

A dozen or so is a perfectly healthy amount out of the hundreds of minigames that get played throughout a week

"You're supposed to rebel when given the chance, not as a way to express dissatisfaction, let alone when you entered a minigame by your own choice. It will only bring up stale gameplay if that's all that ever happened. Which is why the wardens tend to add some restrictions to these minigames to up the stakes. 9crush is in no way different, just more uncommonly played. You can't always expect things to go your way."


So let's say warden does something unfun like Nine Sqaure, and then I decide to rebel. Fair right?
If the warden said let's do obby instead, maybe I wouldn't have rebelled.
Changing Crush Game, and Skill Based minigame, into an RNG one that is a kill order is not fair.
My decision to rebel is eluded due to the unfair subversion.
If you KNEW warden was going to enable CC without a warning in Crush Game, I would argue that would alter your choice to rebel.
We removed that possibility because at the end of the day, it is not fun.

The point of this poll is to ascertain if others agree that the server would be better with it banned. If majority agrees it ought to stay, I more than respect that.

 

[Semicolon Backslash]

If you want to argue that telling Reds to AFK Freeze in Fall Game is Preventing Delay, I can absolutely agree.
The reason 9 Crush is an issue, is because it fundamentally changes Crush Game.

There is also no rule against changing the fundamentals of how a minigame is meant to be played. Custom minigames and modifications of existing games are protected under the rules here as well.

The Warden can come up with Minigames of his own but it must be played out of the range of the cell area.

Minigames that involve Guards killing the Prisoners with little to no input are not allowed unless it's located on the map or is a variation of a existing Minigame on the map.

If we want to liberally stretch the rules, I am personally okay with that, but this is verbatim our rules.

If we want to take your rule verbatim, afk in fall game should be banned as well as if I see my last platform turn red I should be allowed to move from it should I not?

 

[Bananawastaken]

Declining due to poll results