Declined Teamban Appeal (1 Viewer)

[Bananawastaken]

Name of your Banned Steam Account: Banana
Steam ID: STEAM_0:0:138009523
Date and Time of the Ban: 20: something GMT
Reason about the Ban: Baiting by airblasting
Admin that Banned you: Coffee Table
Why should you be unbanned:
Theres a whole video if you want to check the facts.

0:50 When I got the warning
3:45 When the incident happened

I never got a reasonable warning for baiting in the previous round, with a warning coming up despite me never even baiting anyone in the first place.
The engineer ran out of his way to hit the button while his team was on the carpet in a stack so he detoured and thus delayed


The sniper wasn't kos, but it was still an accident of him getting caught up with the engineer as I only airblasted him ONCE and it seems very harsh that I am being punished for ONE mistake (even though Mem intentionally did a failround and you let him off the hook).
It genuinely was an accident and the only mistake I made the entire session. Which I had zero warning for.
Hence me asking for my teamban to be removed, I shouldnt have airblasted the sniper but I feel as if a teamban is way too harsh. I already have a decent amount of understanding of the rules so I don't need the time on red.


Thanks.

 

[Random Coffee Table]

Hello,

I appreciate the video provided, it makes it pretty easy to talk to the events. As you pointed out, there was clearly a warning given not to bait. Warnings are given to the entire server, not just one person. In this case, the warning was given with relation to this exact rule after the demo shot into obby with a pipe and a scout shot right next to a red with a pistol. The whole blue team was warned, including you not to bait. The very next round, you airblasted an engineer who really wasn't even KOS (a miniscule detour to hit a button, while still a part of the group, and then going to continue following) repeatedly and airblasted other reds, me in this case, in the ensuing blast. This has always been baiting/ free hitting and isn't allowed. You chose to airblast someone when they didn't need to be, repeatedly, and were teambanned after a warning had recently been given. I also don't think this was the first time that you airblasted "delaying" reds into a group. There were a few times on that map where reds were airblasted for marginal delays (at best) and while I am not 100% sure that it was you because I was watching other places and only saw the result or heard the sound, I do know that you were around when it happened.

As far as your complaint about Mem goes, he wasn't warned by me specifically not to do that because I didn't know how the game would react because on other maps, notably spacejail, low gravity doesn't affect how some games are played such as obby. After seeing how it worked (and failed miserably), I did give a very clear warning related to it, which you failed to mention, to not do that again and that I would punish for it. It wouldn't be fair to teamban for something that I didn't give a warning on and did not know how it would work. As it is you are just trying to move the goalposts away from what you did towards what others did/ I failed to do. This isn't a report on Mem, it is an appeal about what you specifically did and Mem's mistake did not have any bearing on yours.

I do not think that this should be accepted, as stated above, but it will ultimately come down to Semi's decision on whether or not it is valid.

 

[Bananawastaken]

Thanks for replying, however I personally feel you are wrong on some instances.

The very next round, you airblasted an engineer who really wasn't even KOS (a miniscule detour to hit a button, while still a part of the group

There is a clear visible gap for the engie and the group as he just walks away from it. It wasnt miniscule. It wasnt the wrong decision to go for the engie and it was completely justified.

Like look how much he has to travel to get to the button.

https://imgur.com/a/NeiJCMI

airblasted other reds

I only air blasted you ONCE mind you. It wasn't other "reds" it was just you. And it was one ACCIDENTAL airblast. And I was not even aiming at you.

after a warning had recently been given.

That warning was not for me and it was clearly an accidental freehit that was legit harmless in the grand scheme of things and not a proper warning considering it was my first offence.

You did not even give me a CHANCE, thats a much better phrasing I guess.

while I am not 100% sure that it was you because I was watching other places and only saw the result or heard the sound, I do know that you were around when it happened.

this doesnt mean anything, you can clearly see me airblast a heavy who was clearly delaying in the video so I could easily say that they were delaying in those other scenarios, if they werent delaying you should have given me a warning then...

at the end of the day you still teambanned me without any legitimate warning, as in you did not even give me a chance and the fact that it was an accident stemming from me doing an action that was completely warranted.

Its way too harsh and while I should not have brought up memo because it had no real impact on my appeal (sorry about that hehe).
But I feel as if youre overmoderating and strictness isn't a good thing, you sound like you are looking for excuses to dish out teambans.
Because of some kids shooting in the minigame I get teambanned for one mistake like come on.
You know that you never gave me a proper chance and you also know you got caught up in an accident for something that was very legitimate.
Just because you gave a "warning" does not mean you gave me a chance.

You say "You got teambanned after doing something after you were warned", but in reality it was "You got teambanned for one mistake, you might have freehitted and baited before but idk I never saw it, but because I gave a warning earlier to someone else and my sneaking irrational suspicion you should be teambanned for this obvious accident."


Thanks.

 

[Dr. Meatloaf]

Warnings are given to the entire server, not just one person. In this case, the warning was given with relation to this exact rule after the demo shot into obby with a pipe and a scout shot right next to a red with a pistol. The whole blue team was warned, including you not to bait.

I realize I probably shouldn't get involved in this since it doesn't really concern me, and if admins decide to delete this post for being "irrelevant" that's fine, but seeing as RCT's reasoning for this guardban was almost entirely based on the above statement I just want to point out how ridiculous it is.

When you warn a player, you're warning them to correct THEIR actions. If bananna himself was baiting a previous round then you would have warned him to correct HIS actions. However in this case because bananna was not baiting in previous rounds he was never warned to stop baiting reds. Saying "Don't bait as guards or warden." In the chat isn't "giving every player on the server a warning" as you say it is, it's just warning the two players who were baiting to stop what they are doing. For everybody else on the server you're just reminding them a rule which is very different. Warning a player is not about reminding players certain rules as if they suddenly forgot that you can't bait on BLU, it's about warning players that their conduct is breaking the rules. Maybe if the other two players were air blasting reds and bananna saw them air blasting it would be a different story, but that's clearly not what happened here.

You never warned bananna that HIS conduct was breaking the rules, you simply read a rule in chat earlier in the round. By all logic bananna wasn't warned and you guardbanned him for baiting once (that one instance of baiting being two air blasts in quick succession) even though it had no real impact on anyone. It's clearly too strict to punish someone like this, and you should just remove his guardban and admit that you made a mistake.

 

[Random Coffee Table]

I will clarify a couple of things then:

That level of deviation from the engineer is honestly fine. He made a slight detour (about 1 second) and then turned to keep following the group. Ironically, he was closer to the group before you pushed him away the first time as you can clearly see him turning in. The engineer would not have been KOS and I treated it as such. In my view you freehit/ baited twice in that scenario coming from a lack of understanding of the rules, not an accident.

Airblasting in general is incredibly inaccurate and has a fairly wide AOE. For the same reason you wouldn't wm1 as a pyro at a group of reds, you don't airblast near groups of red. Really the only time you use airblast on blue is if someone is wm1ing towards you and you need space. Otherwise you are practically begging to include other reds in the attack because it isn't limited to just one player, but the group.

As far as warnings go, I'll tag @Dr. Meatloaf as well because it seems he could use a refresher as well. Warnings are given to the WHOLE server, usually based off the actions of at least one individual. We do not, and never have, only given server wide warnings to specific people only, as that defeats the point of the large warnings in the middle of your screen that the entire server can see. What is the point of giving an individual warning to every single blue every time they did something wrong, and then give the exact same warning to someone doing the same thing, or do we need to specifically mention every single player who has done a particular rule break in order for it to be valid? That becomes a waste of time for the admin and prevents us from punishing when we should. If we warn one person not to use a racial slur and then someone else uses one, do we have to warn the whole server again? No, all that does is delay the problem in a pointless attempt to give "everyone a chance". It isn't being "too strict", it is following the basic tenets of how warnings have always been given and viewed by admins and the player base. Changing them for a singular case is myopic and would only further rulebreaking instead of curbing it.

 

[Semicolon Backslash]

Let me end this mess before it gets out of hand

There is a clear visible gap for the engie and the group as he just walks away from it. It wasnt miniscule. It wasnt the wrong decision to go for the engie and it was completely justified.

Like look how much he has to travel to get to the button.

Yet you were still close enough to airblast another red?

I only air blasted you ONCE mind you. It wasn't other "reds" it was just you. And it was one ACCIDENTAL airblast. And I was not even aiming at you.

Valid point, still a careless action.

you airblasted an engineer who really wasn't even KOS

Technically he was kos although 99% of people don't care enough to airblast one engineer opening a door to a red-side game

For everybody else on the server you're just reminding them a rule

A rule that needs to be followed by all players.

I find this whole ordeal unnecessary on both ends, it was completely unneeded to airblast one engineer who went and hit a button to a minigame that leads nowhere. On the other hand coffee should've probably just slayed you instead as only one other red was visibly airblasted. Unless you also want to take into account that you walked next to a large group of reds which is also a careless move that was asking for something bad to happen.

Personally I think you should take this time to become less trigger-happy.

Declined