Simon Says vs Warden's Overriding. (1 Viewer)

[Dandy]

I say something like "Alright Ketteii is Simon" then Ketteii says "Simon Says jump" and everyone who jumped is kos because Simon didn't say you were simon.

I replied immediately, "That would be mass freekill."

This is the quote that started maybe a fifteen minute discussion between myself and another frequent JB player. My logic being that warden cannot lie, and that stating that someone else is Simon, regardless of whether it's preceded by 'Simon Says,' would fall under 'trickery', and thereby isn't allowed. His logic being that "But it's not warden lying, it's Simon lying. I agree it's tricking, but I know I'm right here," and "Simon saying something isn't warden saying something."

Another situation that this logic would apply to include - "We are no longer playing Simon Says." This is more specifically warden overriding, but also a bit of tricking if someone dies from it.

So, just wondering, what's the actual policy? It's rather left unspecified in the rules. Just looking for clarity. ( :

 

[TBotV63]

See where this "I am Simon" "x is Simon" "Hello I have a dog named Simon" shit gets us? Also the rules aren't some sort of religion, common sense may be applied where necessary, even without there being an extra case example or exception in the rules.

As for what the rules say:

Simon says is a Gamemode where the Prisoners have to follow "Simon AKA the Warden" to follow Simons orders, if the Prisoner fails to follow Simons order he will be killed.

It appears as though it isn't intended for the warden to delegate the task of running the game at all.

 

[Nick On Sunday Nights]

See where this "I am Simon" "x is Simon" "Hello I have a dog named Simon" shit gets us? Also the rules aren't some sort of religion, common sense may be applied where necessary, even without there being an extra case example or exception in the rules.

As for what the rules say:


It appears as though it isn't intended for the warden to delegate the task of running the game at all.

But if warden isn't really able to do that, then doesn't that mean whoever listens to the "new Simon" is in fact KOS? And in Ketteii's quote of ending Simon says, I feel as though Simon has more power overall when it comes to giving orders. If Warden only can be Simon, and warden wants to end Simon Says, he couldn't technically say "We're no longer playing Simon Says." because Simon has to say it. I imagine it as a big family being at Simon's house. Warden is the mother and REDs are the children. Simon is the grandfather. The children must listen to mother or they will be punished. But when they are at their strict grandfather's house, they know that they have to listen to him because he raised their mother with very strict rules. Grandfather has more power over his grandchildren than the mother does because he is very strict and hard on his children and grandchildren. Then, only Grandfather can say when Mother is in charge again. Mother can't say, "Don't listen to Grandfather" because he will punish her. Or in more simpler terms, You and some friends are at your friend Simon's house. He's never the bossy one, but it's his house and you're the guests so you have to listen. You have to listen only to what he says and not what Willie says because Willie isn't in charge. Then, when you leave Simon's house, you can listen to Willie again, because he's in charge again. I tried to make this not too confusing, but I think it makes sense. I can add to it more elaborately if needed.

 

[Spam Goose]

makes sense, but warden shouldn't give the task of simon to someone else, if he doesn't want to be simon, don't be warden

 

[Husky]

makes sense, but warden shouldn't give the task of simon to someone else, if he doesn't want to be simon, don't be warden

Do you have any idea on how the gamemode actually works or do you just comment on every thread...

 

[Nick On Sunday Nights]

makes sense, but warden shouldn't give the task of simon to someone else, if he doesn't want to be simon, don't be warden

No, that's not what he's saying. He's asking if since Warden isn't able to give Simon away, whoever listens to the new non-warden simon is kos.

 

[Spam Goose]

Husky i've played it before, but like was like 3 years ago, and nick is right about what I am saying. but also, if the warden wants to do simon says, but doesn't want to be simon, he shouldn't do it

 

[Travis]

I think it matters on how the warden says it, the official way is saying it is the following, "Simon says ____ is Simon.". If he said "Ketteii is Simon", then no one is actually simon in my opinion. The offical commands from what I know are "Simon says we are playing Simon says." and "Simon says ____ is Simon." If they phrase it any way other than Simon saying someone is Simont then I would see that as possible tricking if they intended to fool the reds or just create mass confusion within the server.

 

[Spam Goose]

but I have been posting on a lot of threads lately because I haven't been on my pc (on chromebook) so I wanted to start posting on here

 

[Spam Goose]

yea Travis that is smart, so you would count warden saying ''x is simon" as trickery.

 

[Nick On Sunday Nights]

Well also, what people have to realize is, for BLUs, the goal is to kill as many REDs as possible legitimately. This meaning, if they don't listen to even the smallest of things, they will be killed. Simon Says is honestly its own game inside of Jailbreak. It is based around tricking. There's no denying that Simon Says has a lot of tricking. It's probably one of the easiest ways to eliminate most REDs in one go aside from meat grinder. I feel like tricking doesn't apply here. I mean I know it does, but it really shouldn't. It's its own game, and should have more elaborated rules.

 

[Nick On Sunday Nights]

Also yeah, what Travis said about Warden's wording of things. I can't tell if this is what he meant but, if Warden gives an order while Simon Says is going on, whoever followed that order is KOS. The only elaboration needed is saying that one sentence. Warden's orders do not apply until Simon Says is over. Simon Says only ends once Simon says "Simon says we are no longer playing Simon Says." Also, now that we have clarification on the fact that only Warden can be Simon, there's no need to say "Simon Says I am Simon" or "Simon Says I am no longer Simon."

 

[Spam Goose]

Yea I agree with that, but the problem with Simon Says, there is always a way to get around the rules, loop holes. Saying someone is simon, but warden is still simon (2 simons). Idk all of them, but when I used to play, we found all sorts of loop holes to not get kos while doing Simon says.

 

[Nick On Sunday Nights]

Yea I agree with that, but the problem with Simon Says, there is always a way to get around the rules, loop holes. Saying someone is simon, but warden is still simon (2 simons). Idk all of them, but when I used to play, we found all sorts of loop holes to not get kos while doing Simon says.

There is no loophole. We just got clarification from the rules that only Warden can technically be Simon (The only time that doesn't apply is when Warden says someone else can give orders, which is allowed in the rules). Warden is still Simon unless he says "Simon says X is Simon" because that would fall under Warden giving someone else the ability to give orders (which, again, is allowed).

 

[Travis]

It's based off of listening skills more than Trickery, But the way you make someone simon can be trickery, which is not allowed.

 

[Nick On Sunday Nights]

It's based off of listening skills more than Trickery, But the way you make someone simon can be trickery, which is not allowed.

First of all, what do you mean "make someone Simon"? If you're referring to the "X is Simon," then whoever listens to his orders is kos, that's not trickery because Warden is still Simon. You have to say "Simon Says X is Simon" which would fall under warden giving someone else the ability to give orders, which again, is allowed. At that point, anyone listening to the new Simon is not KOS because Warden isn't Simon anymore.

 

[Kyl3]

Oof thats alotta text that I don't want to read, so I'm just going to leave this here.

Simon Says needs a rule clarification on what can and can't be done.
It is getting confusing trying to keep track of what is allowed during this game.

 

[Valen]

I'm just gonna say, that if rules were treated 100% like religion the simon says gamemode wouldn't be allowed at all. The entire concept of Simon says is to trick the prisoners to disobey you. With the logic stated above, Simon Says should be banned because warden can't trick. Unless Simon Says is banned this argument will show up over and over unless clarification is made. By clarification I mean somewhat what Kyle said, about there being rules set for the Gamemode in specific.

 

[Dandy]

First of all, what do you mean "make someone Simon"? If you're referring to the "X is Simon," then whoever listens to his orders is kos, that's not trickery because Warden is still Simon. You have to say "Simon Says X is Simon" which would fall under warden giving someone else the ability to give orders, which again, is allowed. At that point, anyone listening to the new Simon is not KOS because Warden isn't Simon anymore.

Simon says is a Gamemode where the Prisoners have to follow "Simon AKA the Warden" to follow Simons orders, if the Prisoner fails to follow Simons order he will be killed.

No. You are not allowed to make another individual Simon in a game of Simon Says.

Saying "I am Simon and we are playing Simon Says" isn't trickery either; you, the warden, are saying that you are now also Simon. @Spam Goose XIII

 

[Nick On Sunday Nights]

No. You are not allowed to make another individual Simon in a game of Simon Says.

Saying "I am Simon and we are playing Simon Says" isn't trickery either; you, the warden, are saying that you are now also Simon. @Spam Goose XIII

Also in the rules:
Prisoners will only take orders from the Warden unless the Warden says otherwise. This applies to Simon Says as well. Then again, only Simon's Orders apply during Simon Says, so it is required to say "Simon says X is now Simon." There can only be 1 simon at a time. It is Warden by default unless given to another BLU with "Simon says" at the beginning.