Awaiting Feedback Remove or Fix Spyper on #13 - Freak Fortress (1 Viewer)

Should Spyper, at its current state, be fixed, removed, or unchanged?


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Darkwolf

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Spyper is one of the only Bosses that have the ability to heavily delay a round because of his long cloak, teleportation, and constant need to hide in order to shoot with his gun peacefully.
Mostly when someone is spyper, the round can end up beeing 3x longer than usual, letting people get impatient at times. I will state the 2 main issues for spyper in short.

-Way too long cloak, turning the gamemode more to a Hide and Seek, rather than FF2.
-Has the ability to pick up ammo, letting him fill up his Rifle, which causes him to camp even more.


To fix these problems, I would suggest reducing the cloak durability about half, and to remove the ability to refill his Rifle with ammopacks.
Else, the option to remove, or perhaps even replace him with a new boss, can also be a option.

Feel free to state your opinion on Spyper and what should be done with him.
 

Dukedragon4

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Honestly as a spyper main I do agree spyper will often be used to camp and kill one by one every players, making rounds very very long. The main problem to this is the fact he is unable to disarm (by stun, hiding screen, ect) players and have a relative small health pool, making him more careful to directly attack the players as it almost pure suicide for him. A great ways to balance the boss without ruining the fun to play it would be to do the changes Darky mentionned but also to give him a biggger health pool and when he rage, to stun every nearby players. Of course it would make it look more similar to gentlespy but it seriously need to have a better survival skill to prevent camping and allows him to face players more.
 

Madact

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@Darkwolf

Is there a link to this fix? Or someone you know who can do this? We can't exactly provide a fix.
 

BreadandYeast

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The fix for Spyper is to delete him.

Reasons why:

  • Hale has a sniper rifle (A big no no, in fact snipers should be blocked from FF2 completely)
  • Only way to win as Spyper is to camp, which is unfun for both sides
  • Spyper has cloak + point teleport which encourages camping even more
  • Outcome of all matches with Spyper usually either is Spyper instantly dying due to poor head to head combat or Spyper winning by playing a game of cat and mouse for 10 mins with the sniper + cloak + point teleport cheese.
In other words, good fucking luck trying to balance Spyper without changing his core kit entirely.
 

Loli Police

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If y'all need the changes done, give me a list of what needs to be changed and I can edit the CFG easily.
 

Loli Police

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Cant we just get a fully update to all the Hales that need a buff / nerf? Like i would enjoy that more and other people too than just a Spyper nerf or remove
We could however we would need a vote on all the changes and it would need to pass, as well as it would need to be tested and approved by Kevin before being final.
 
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BreadandYeast

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You folks need to stop relying on forum voting and actually discuss the changes with server players, voting doesn't work with only 10 voters, thats called an oligarchy. Take the opinion of the more experienced and frequent players on the server and reach a conclusion.

Also, once again, the only way to fix Spyper is to delete him or change his core kit entirely, so good luck trying to balance him.
 
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Dukedragon4

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You folks need to stop relying on forum voting and actually discuss the changes with server players, voting doesn't work with only 10 voters, thats called an oligarchy. Take the opinion of the more experienced and frequent players on the server and reach a conclusion.

Also, once again, the only way to fix Spyper is to delete him or change his core kit entirely, so good luck trying to balance him.
I agree for the voting part, we need more people to vote it, and extremely actives players and who played on the server for a while.


For nerfing Spyper, I think some modifications that can be done is:
-Cannot collect ammo or refill his cloak by such way (it the main reason why he camp, but nerfing just that will make the boss totally bad)
-Bigger health pool (making him more likely to try to face people as his current health pool is too small for direct encounter)
-When rage, he get gun (like actually) but also stun all nearby players and sentries (another of his weakness and wat force him to camp is the fact he cannot disarm players in close range, so charging into the players is suicidal right now. Stunning will allow him to be more aggressive)
-Less cloak, so he stay hidden less time (I noticed the cloak duration is big, and if refilled with ammo, cant be annoying to desl against)
Bonus, if after nerfing, the boss is not balanced enough:
-more or less ammo on his rifle
-Cannot take health pack (I found that you can use health pack to extinguish or remove liquids (jarate, milk, water) yourself, which increase spyper survability. I think it a vital element for making the boss unique AND make it at least fun to play (Pyro are so annoying when you play this boss after all) but the removal can nerf him easily)
-I was thinking of a solo rage, a bit like Beep Man's one, but it kind of too much. Yet, if the boss need balacing, it can be good.
So, in conclusion, despite the boss being totally horrible for his camping abilities, it can be possible to nerf him without deleting him or completely modify his core in my opinion. It might be hard and take time, but I am sure there others ways.

Lastly, I think the others bosses who need to be nerfed are, in priority:
-Mimicer (absolutely cancer and OP, he got ways too much abilities)
-Spyper (Camping, Delaying and annoying to fight against, transform the game into a hide n' seek)
-Gentlespy (Cancer in my opinion, but more fair than the two one below)
-Gayben (I know that is rage is the core of this boss, but I think there is ways to make it slightly less... OP?)

Again, take note it only my opinion, therefore shouldnt be based just on this. I just mains spyper and got to know his weakness and strenghts, but I am curious to see wat others players think about it
 

BreadandYeast

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Mimicer just needs his health halved again
Gentlespy needs an actual rage damage formula. (Maybe reduce ammo on his lasor pointer too)
As for Gaben, making medics start with more or full uber would suffice, the issue here is that at the start of the round every single anti-gamer soldier and spy just dogpile on him allowing him to get 100% rage instantly before the whole red team (especially medics) can actually prepare for his rage. And then proceed to complain that Gaben is OP
 

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