db stealing thx exception allowed? (1 Viewer)

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mrbooooom

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I just like to ask the admins to clarify a point about stealing.

During a recent game a player stole several times – with the excuse that the rocket went to his face. Not a noob I might add.

Well, he was mostly standing at -or moving around the middle, sometimes placing himself on top of a dispenser. He stole several times.

Nothing new and normally if there is an admin online he would slay such players.



But in this case it went on and the admin actually defended the stealer, saying that it is allowed to steal if something comes your way and if it would kill you otherwise.

No way to say who the admins was..just ALL Admin chat.

I think he referred to this rule here at the forum “…Only blast it when you get the sentry noise, unless you absolutely have to save yourself from dying.”



There is another admin who immediately slays even if there was just airblasting..no actual thefts.

Personally I totally agree. Simple rule: don’t blast a rocket if it is not yours. Don’t even try. If you are in the way and can’t move anymore…well..bad luck. Next time you chose a better position.


If this exception to the rule is used as excuse for stealing then it should be abolished.



I’m absolutely in favor of a zero tolerance for stealing. No exceptions, no excuses.


Cheers

Booooom
 
It varies 'cause each admin has his/her own ways of enforcing the rules.

I administrate over on USDB. Here's what I consider to be stealing/attempting to steal:
  • If they're running towards the direction of the rocket and airblasting.
  • If they're walking in front of the enemy with the rocket, knowing they'll be hit, and airblasting.
  • If they're airblasting rockets that are close to 'em, but won't kill 'em.
The only times I allow a person to steal is if they're standing still, and the rocket is going to 'em, or if they're statuing with their friends. I know a previous USDB admin, who would tell players to stop statuing together, 'cause he/she considered it as stealing. Again, each admin has his/her own perspectives of what's considered stealing.
 
From my experience, it's NOT okay what he did.
It's okay if he stood on the far left/right or back of the map and the rocket got literally spiked into his face so he can save himself, but standing in the middle just to have this excuse is forbidden. I've seen Deadsworn, Lighty and Nitro say that so I'm guessing that's the way it is.
Of course you can suggest a rule change so stealing is forbidden with no exceptions at all, I'm sure many (including me) would support it.
 
I slay if someone attempts to airblast a rocket that isn't theirs. The fact that they lived to be slain is a clear indicator that the rocket wouldn't have - and didn't - hit them. If a rocket is flying at someone's face and cant be avoided by moving (something which is up to the admin) I won't slay.

And it's easy for you to say that, after all you mostly just stand in a corner frequently try to kill people with rockets that aren't theirs and forcing them to steal.

As I already said on my application LOL

I believe that intent should play a role in punishment and thus I would try make it a factor in my punishments.

If someone steals to gain an advantage such as
  • getting the rocket more often
  • getting easy kills by surprising others
I will consider that malicious. I will also slay people who have no idea what they're doing so I can inform them about the rules.

I do not see why someone who was forced to steal to avoid death should be punished for doing so. Especially as that's also how it's written in the Rules. I'd also like to point out that I saw the user steal precisely once, and then I got caught up in this stupid argument with you so I couldn't really pay attention.

As for that single steal I saw, it is, in theory, completely covered by the rules as an exception:

No rocket stealing or attempting to steal rockets. Only blast it when you get the sentry noise, unless you absolutely have to save yourself from dying. This does not include standing still and when it gets close blasting it. Additionally, going over to the enemy side is an own risk you choose to take. If you do not leave your enemy enough space and they have to steal, it’s not their fault; it’s yours. When an enemy gets to your side, keep in mind that this is not forbidden in itself and is something you have to accommodate for.

Especially because the user, as far as I saw, was not

standing in the middle just to have this excuse

They actually seemed to be making an effort to only steal when a rocket was really heading for them.

I'd also like to point out that octagon with 16 (?) players is rather crowded and It's hard to find a safe place to stand at all.

Oh and one last thing:

Personally I totally agree. Simple rule: don’t blast a rocket if it is not yours. Don’t even try. If you are in the way and can’t move anymore…well..bad luck. Next time you chose a better position.

If this exception to the rule is used as excuse for stealing then it should be abolished.

After your reaction to being slain for attempting to steal a rocket that wasn't heading anywhere near you (unlike the user you were referring to in this thread), stating that it was going to hit you, don't you think that this is a maybe just a tad hypocritical?
 
Of course you can suggest a rule change so stealing is forbidden with no exceptions at all, I'm sure many (including me) would support it.
You may suggest this rule change; however, I can assure you that only a few would support it.

If the 0 tolerance stealing rule is passed..
  • No stealing nukes.
  • No statuing with friends.
  • No stealing from players, who are stripped to melee, frozen, or forced taunt.
  • No stealing from players, who are orbiting the rockets too close or standing directly behind you.
If this rule is passed, I'm going to resign 'cause this rule is absurd :kappa:
 
You may suggest this rule change; however, I can assure you that only a few would support it.

If the 0 tolerance stealing rule is passed..
  • No stealing nukes.
  • No statuing with friends.
  • No stealing from players, who are stripped to melee, frozen, or forced taunt.
  • No stealing from players, who are orbiting the rockets too close or standing directly behind you.
If this rule is passed, I'm going to resign 'cause this rule is absurd :kappa:
You're right, didn't think of that.
 
Thanks for all the replies.

Obviously a strict “no stealing – no exceptions” policy would not make sense. that was not what I meant. Tolerating and encouraging stealing in the middle is something else than stealing nukes...

Stealing nukes should be allowed because a mess-up will affect everybody around.

Also stealing from RTD-melee , frozen, taunting players makes sense. But on the other hand they chose to use RTD and know the risks involved… (Btw I think RTD should be turned off completely considering how many lags it is causing.)

Statue-ing or wall…I see no problems with that as long players don’t do it in the middle of a map ; stealing everything coming their way…
if they "steal" from each other in a wall is ok, but if they steal from somebody else it is not, I would say.

If a teammate moved right behind you or is too close and orbits into you…I think it should be allowed to protect yourself. But of course there will be players abusing this exception. So I rather would be in favor not allowing that.



I think players who stand in the middle or very close to the other team do this to get an advantage. In case they roll toxic, timebomb , avoiding sudden switches and if they get a rocket to surprise someone close. Fair enough. But there should be NO excuses whatsoever to steal if a rocket is coming their way. They chose the position, enjoy the advantages and should live (or die) with the disadvantages.



Regarding the mentioned incident, Tbot brought up: I airblasted at a rocket (missed! - not actually stole it!) orbiting suddenly around my face … that was surprising because like always I was standing in the corner…Somebody must have come behind or next to me without me noticing. Otherwise whose rocket was it?

So I got slayed for airblasting at a rocket once – no big deal. fair enough IF THIS IS THE RULE. I can live with that.

But then please same rules for everybody.

Tbot, now , after I know that it was you in both incidences I must say I find this a bit strange.

Allowing some player to actual steal (not even discouraging him but telling it is ok) several times and slaying others immediately for air blasting once?!



Maybe it would make sense to fine-tune the written rules a bit?!

For instance I can’t even find a rule exception in writing that would allow stealing nukes. How can new players know about this?

I hope we can make this game and the rules as fair. simple and transparent as possible.

Cheers

Booooom
 
Allowing some player to actual steal (not even discouraging him but telling it is ok) several times and slaying others immediately for air blasting once?!

I wasn't telling him anything. He stated it was ok to save, you said it wasn't, I clarified by quoting the rules. As I had mentioned, I joined rather late and missed the most of his alleged steals. I wouldn't know. I was merely telling you, regardless of what he was doing, that saving is allowed. Would I have let all of his supposed steals go through as saving? Probably not if I had seen them. The only steal I saw was a save and I was rather busy arguing with you at that point.

I hope I was able to clarify the lack of action. I was not (and didn't mean to) encourage him in what he was doing. For the last couple weeks I have been handleing the majority of calls, and you should know that I'm not easy on stealing, if I actually see it.
 
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